Graflex.org

[tommy1219]

Hello guys,

I'm new to large format photography and I've just got myself a Crown 4x5. I have several questions that I will really appreciate if you can answer them all:

- My Crown's Serial Number was 918516, can someone tell me the date it was born? I tried my best to find the Manufacturing Code like some other threads suggested, but I couldn't find it -- if possible can somebody please post a picture of your own Crown's M.Code so I can find its location more easily?

- The top rangefinder doesn't seem to be working. I popped open the battery door, and there were batteries rusted in there, seemed to be forgotten in there 30 years ago. Should I repair it? Is the rangefinder essential? My friend told me that focusing on the ground glass is all I would ever need, but he was just guessing and told me to ask experts.

- The lens was Ektar 127mm f/4.7, seems to be in working order. But when I clean it, I noticed a very small bubble within the glass, size about the head of a needle -- will that be a trouble?

My favorite is landscape, by the way.

Thank you all, I will appreciate any help.

[Les]

The batteries don't control the rangefinder, they are for something else. Two things you should check. The easiest one to describe is the plunger in the body near the rails.

Open the camera and rack out the the rails (where the lens is doen't matter at this point) on the inner left side (handle side) of the body is a tube that end with a chrome pin. On the rails there is a stop. When you move the rails in and out you move this pin and (through a bunch of small balls and cylinders inside the tube) moves the rangefinder on top.

The pin could be bent and stuck, or somebody pulled the cap off and the balls and pins went everywhere. Pins can be straightened, balls and pins are a bugger to replace. If that's the case, then the ground glass is your best bet, but I find a well tunes range finder comes in handy once in a while.

The next possibility is the cam inside the rangefinder is missing. Look around the web for an owners manual, there will be a picture of what goes on in the rangefinder.

The bubble in the glass is of no consequence.
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"In order to invent, you need a good imagination and a lot of junk" Thomas Edison

[C. Henry]

A while back there was a "Serial Number Savy" forum on this site. One of the members, Shutterfinger, composed a listing of replies on that forum arranged in serial number order. Shortly after that list was made available by Shutterfinger the "Serial Number Savy" forum (including Shutterfinger's list) was deleted. Several of us saved copies of that list with Shutterfinger's permission. On Shutterfinger's List #919489 and #919713 are listed as "crown - 1956" therefore I would assume that your camera was made in 1956. Assuming the Ektar is the original lens a further confirmation would be the two letters that begin the serial numbers of Ektar lenses. They are a date code, RO would be 1956.

As to the rangefinder question, I will leave that to the 4 x 5 users although I seldom use the side rangefinder on my 1947 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 Speed Graphic.

The size and location of the "bubble" will determine if it is a problem. I suggest trying the camera to see if it causes any noticeable loss of quality in the image.

C. Henry

[tommy1219]

Thank you Les and Henry,

The bubble is really really small, perhaps just about 1/4 the actual size of this dot . I'm still waiting for films to come to test it. I'm in college in such a small town that I have to order everything online

The CAM is still there, I checked it. But the chrome pin you said is completely unactive when I move the focusing rail, hence the rangefinder.

Do I really need to get a new rangefinder? I meant, if I'm focusing on the ground glass, why would I bother about looking through the rangefinder? I'm sorry if this sounds stupid to you, but Large Format is really a mystery to a DSLRer.

[Les]

I live in Detroit / South Eastern Michigan and I have to order everything on line.

As to the rangefinder. It's an ether or situation. For landscapes you probably be trioding it anyway, so you use the ground glass. If you want to do a quick landscape shot, you'll use the focus scale and set it an infinity anyway.

I found the best use of the rangefinder is shooting people in the 10-20ft range.

The balls and cylinders are almost impossible to replace, so if they are missing, then the question is moot. If it took a little tweak here to get it running again then why not.

The batteries ran a lightbulb in the rangefinder. These rangefinders were pretty useless in the dark, so they came up with this cute little trick. You could push the red button on the handle side and light the lamp inside the RF. The RF would project the image of the filament onto the subject, You adjusted the the focus until both images were coincident and you were in focus! Useless for mountains 10 miles away in the sun.
_________________
"In order to invent, you need a good imagination and a lot of junk" Thomas Edison

[mopar_guy]

Welcome to the this forum.

For critical focusing for landscapes, use a tripod, focus using the ground glass and a loupe(preferred method).

Also, for hand held shots, it is very handy to have a working rangefinder to speed up the the use of your camera. This can greatly aid the use of the camera for people pics, animal photos, and action.

A third way to focus in a hurry is to use focusing scales on the rails of the camera. The scales must be matched for the focal length lens being used. This method can be unsatisfactory but stopping down will help. Also the infinity stops must be correctly set up.

Keep in mind that in large format, most lenses will have a shallower depth of field at any given f-stop than 35mm at the same stop.

Regards,
Dave

[glennfromwy]

Bubbles in the lens glass will have absolutely no effect whatsoever on performance. Lenses from the late 19th and early 20th centuries often had bubbles in the glass. Some of thos bubbly lenses were fantastic image makers. Not to worry.
Top mounted rangefinder? My personal opinion of those is extremely low. I wouldn'y waste my time if it was mine. If I had it, I would hang in there until I ran across a nice Kalart side mounted rangefinder. The hole for the shaft should be there, under the hide.
If your going to do mostly landscapes, ground glass focusing will be fine. It's always best, anyway. A proper focus scale is handy and will serve as well as a rangfinder. Check your focus scale against the ground glass image at measured distances to see if it's the right one for the lens. Good luck and have fun.
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Glenn

"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"

[mopar_guy]

I agree with Glenn. I like early pacemaker cameras (up to about 1955) with the side mount Kalart rangefinder. Look for Graflok backs for more versatility as some of the first Pacemakers have Graphic back and are more difficult to use rollholders with.

I also really like Anniversary Speed Graphics. The Anniversary model may lack some of the features of the Pacemaker, but if you put them side by side, the Anniversary speed seems to be slightly better made. I also like the older rear shutter with the six different tension settings.

Some have said that the later cameras with the top rangefinder can be problematic to keep the rangefinders working.

Dave

[tommy1219]

Thank you Glen and Dave for your invaluable responses.

When reading your answers, however, another question popped up in my mind: How do I know that the focusing scale on the rail is correct? I read somewhere that it varies from lens to lens, so it may need adjustments. Is there any thread around here that tell me how to check/adjust that?

I saw numbers and marks on the rail, but I honestly have no idea how to read/use them. Please teach me.

My lens is Ektar 127mm f/4.7 by the way.

[Les]

the scale is engraved for each lens as to its actual focal length (the 127mm is approx.)

The best way is to test it your self, set it to INF. open the lens, point the camera at something a couple of blocks away and look at the ground glass.

Do the same for 15, 10 & 8ft The only adjustment you can do is to move the scale on the rails. These don't get moved or fall out of adjustment very often. The more common case is somebody switched out lenses and the scale is for a 135mm
_________________
"In order to invent, you need a good imagination and a lot of junk" Thomas Edison

[tommy1219]

I'm sorry Les, but I'm still confused. Could you please give me some more detail instruction? (i.e: to where do I extend the bellow? Do I rack the rail all the way in or run it out? ...)

[mopar_guy]

If you want to check that the focusing scales are set up correctly:

1. Pick a clear/bright day and set up the camera on a tripod.

2. To set infinity focus, open the camera, pull out the standard to the infinity stops and lock it down. Use the focusing knob to move the camera rails all the way to the rear. Now use the ground glass and focus on any object that is at least 200-300 feet distant. If the infinity stops are set up correctly, you should not have had to refocus, the infinity setting should be with the rail racked all the way back.

3. On the bed of the camera there should be two engraved tags attached. The outer scale is fastened to the camera bed an stays stationary. The inner scale is fastened to the focus rail and moves with the rail as you focus to different distances. There should be an infinity symbol on both the outer and inner scale that looks like the numeral 8 on it's side. With the camera focused on the distant object, the infinity symbols on the outer and inner scales should align. If they don't align, the inner scale can be moved on the rail by loosening the two screws and sliding the scale on the rail.

4. With a tape measure you can set up a test object at the various different distances that are on your set of scales and check that the lens will be focused at these distances.

Hope this helps.

Dave
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I guess that I could get a digital camera but it would be obsolete in a couple of years (three tops). Or I could use my 3x4 Anniversary Speed Graphic. Heck, it's been obsolete for 50 years. That's way better than digital.

[troublemaker]

Infinity is ussually set with the rails slightly forward, 1/16 to 1/8", not all the way back.

[mopar_guy]

Troublemaker is correct.
Thanks for the correction.

Dave