Graflex.org

bforcade · Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 6 Location: Chicago

Just got my first Speed Graphic today (graflok back and "23" roll film holder) and have a few focus questions.
1. Before I try to focus, how far out should I pull the front lens group before tightening it? It seems that the small focus movement is far less than the much larger bellows-front lens group movement.

2. When focusing does the fresnel go farthest forward, then the ground glass, then the film holder (or do you remove the ground glass and fresnel after focusing before you put in the film holder?

3. When using the "23" 120 film back do you remove the fresnel & ground glass before putting the 23 back on?

Sorry if these seem like overly simple questions, but I've read the FAQ and couldn't figure it out. Thanks for any help.

Les · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 2682 Location: Detroit, MI

Hey if they weren't simple questions I couldn't answer them!

First off there should be some 'bumps' on the focus rails. these are called stops. Pull the front standard up to those stops and lock the standard down. Now if your lucky, the rangefinder should work and coincide with the ground glass. If it doesn't then your in the club with the rest of us.

The ground glass assembly needs to be removed from the back (via the Graflok system) in order to put the 120 back on. that way the image that fell on the ground glass can now fall on the film.

If you've seperated the ground glass from the fresnel, then the fresnel goes toward the lens first. This sight states unequivically that the ridges go towards the lens. Graflex repair manuals have stated the ridges go towards the the ground glass. (this won't be the last time you'll get contradictory information here! It's half the fun) The ground part of the ground glass goes towards the lens too.

45PSS · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 4:44 am Post subject:

1. Before I try to focus, how far out should I pull the front lens group before tightening it? It seems that the small focus movement is far less than the much larger bellows-front lens group movement

Answer: Open the camera and lock the bed at 90 degrees. Turn the focus knobs to run the rails all the way into the camera body. Check the rails on the bed and see if there are little tabs that will fold over, if so position them up. Release the front standard and pull it out until it contacts the stops then lock it in place. If no stops are installed then while looking at the ground glass release and pull the front standard out until infinity is in sharp focus and lock standard there.

2. When focusing does the fresnel go farthest forward, then the ground glass, then the film holder (or do you remove the ground glass and fresnel after focusing before you put in the film holder?
Answer: The ground glass and fresnel should be mounted into the frame and not come out unless you remove their retainer screws and brackets. http://www.graflex.org/speed-graphic/features.html#GraflokBack tell correct order. Remove from frame only to clean or replace. When focus on gg/fresnel has been achieved and you are ready to shoot pull back on the liped side of the back and insert the film holder between the gg frame and back, push it all the way in, you will feel or hear it snap in.
Remove darkslide and shoot, reinstall darkslide, pull back slightly on film halder and remove.

3. When using the "23" 120 film back do you remove the fresnel & ground glass before putting the 23 back on?
Answer:Yes the gg/fresnel frame portion must be removed.http://www.graflex.org/speed-graphic/features.html#GraflokBack shows how.

Happy shooting.

_________________
The best camera ever made is the one that YOU enjoy using and produces the image quality that satifies YOU.

bforcade · Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 6 Location: Chicago

Les:
You said, "First off there should be some 'bumps' on the focus rails. these are called stops." I don't see anything special on my rails, maybe I'm not looking for the right thing, what do these stops look like? Are they a part of the rail, something under (or next to) the rail? Are these the same "tabs" described by 45PSS as, "Check the rails on the bed and see if there are little tabs that will fold over, if so position them up."

I can smoothly pull the front standard all the way off the front of the focusing rails, without hitting any stops.

Again, thanks for your help.

bforcade · Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 6 Location: Chicago

45PSS:
Thanks for the reply. You said, "The ground glass and fresnel should be mounted into the frame and not come out unless you remove their retainer screws and brackets." appears my camera came with the "23" back, but no ground glass or fresnel" I'm sure I would like to have this option on my camera. Do I have to buy a ground glass/fresnel assembly, or can I just make a ground glass by cutting glass to the correct size and frosting it?

45PSS · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 4:57 am Post subject:

If your camera came with the film holder installed and no other parts then you do not have the focus pannel that holds the gg/fresnel. Making a panel would require a machine shop and template and I do not know how to etch glass.

Infinity stops mount to the outside of the rails and when in the stop position stop the front standard from going beyond that point. If they are not there then look for a line marked on the rails or the bed. If no line then possibally parts have been removed, if the previous owner was shooting rollfilm they had some form of focusing established.

Go to the home page, click on "cameras", t everything you have ask here, it might explain it better as it has PICTURES!

If you find you need a focus panel try EBAY.

_________________
The best camera ever made is the one that YOU enjoy using and produces the image quality that satifies YOU.

hellerharris · Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 46 Location: Los Angeles

Hi -

I have my first Graphic and just read (with horror) the post about setting the infinity stops. I just discovered that they flipped over, and had been setting the lens board on body side of the stop. If I understand 45PSS's post, I should be setting the lens board on the far side of the infinity stops. Is that correct?

thanks.

________
Mercedes-Benz 220

alecj · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 853 Location: Alabama

Whoa, you misread something. When opening the camera, pull the lens standard out until it is stopped by the infinity stops. As you described it, you'd have to fold down the stops, move the standard past them, set them back up, then pull the standard back against them. No way!

Leave the stops up. The standard goes between them and the body itself. OK?

extraparts · Joined: 10 Feb 2002 Posts: 59 Location: texas

Hellerharris

Relax.

The reason the stops flip down is so that you can use several sets if you have several lenses. I.E. you have a 90, a 135 and a 270. You would have three sets of stops. They have to flip down so that you can get the standard past the 90,and 135 set if you are using a 270.

You flip up the stops you are using and pull the standard out till it hits those and lock it down.

I have heard of people with long lenses setting their stops so that they take the standard off the rails and re-insert from the front to get just a little extra extension but I think it is quite rare.

If in doubt measure. Unless you are using a telephoto lens, the distance from the ground glass to the center of the lens will be about the focal lingth. If you were doing it wrong, everything would be way out of focus.

Bforcade

Did you get your camera on Ebay? If so post the auction number and we can see what you are dealing with.

There are several ways to focus a Speed Graphic. Ground Glass, Range Finder and Scale. Normaly using a roll film back, I think most people would use the range finder or scale focusing. I can't defend that statement but it just seems obvious to me.

You should have a little pointer and scale next to your rail) For everything but ground glass the standard must be positioned so that if you focus on something say 20 feet away,with the ground glass, both the range finder and the scale agree.

It is possiable that someone with multiple lenses and cameras took the stops off your camera so that they would have more than one set of stops on a single camera.

If so, I suggest you call Midwest Photo and order a set. I don't think that they cost much.

Then if you don't have the correct ground glass back go borrow one from a camera store or someone else, set your stops and use the range finder from then on.

Neal

hellerharris · Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 46 Location: Los Angeles

thanks. Glad I got that straightened out. I've only run a few rolls through the camera and it hasn't been quite as sharp as I'd like. I'm trying to sort through the possible probs of camera shake, rangefinder and film flatness.

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Suzuki T20

extraparts · Joined: 10 Feb 2002 Posts: 59 Location: texas

This is a real cheap way out of your problem.

1) Focus the camera with the range finder at infinity. Real infinity. I focus on a grain elevator about 5 miles away. Lock the rails.

2)Put your roll film back on your camera and take the film carrier out. (You will now just have the door and an empty frame on your camera.)

3) Get a small piece of glass that will fit where the film goes.

4) Spray something on it like cooking greese, glass wax, etc anything that will give you a surface like a ground glass that you can focus on. Tape it in place.(It must be flat against the film guides.)The coated surface should be toward the lens or you will be out of focus by the thickness of the glass.

5)Open your lens to full apature, and get a magnifying glass and slide your front standard back and forth until your (grain silo) or what ever, is in exact focus. Lock it down and mark that spot on the rails.

6) Go take pictures.

hellerharris · Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 46 Location: Los Angeles

Any reason why that method is better than using the ground glass that came with the camera? The hood sticks out almost 2 1/2 inches; my regular cheap-o loupe only sticks out 1 1/2. Is there a better way to focus? I read a post where someone used a 50mm lens. Is that a good way to go?

thanks

________
bho hash oil

alecj · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 853 Location: Alabama

No, I don't see any advantage to going the "greasy" way, either! The ground glass focus should be find. Anything that magnifies the image for you can be used.

extraparts · Joined: 10 Feb 2002 Posts: 59 Location: texas

I may have misunderstood. I didn't think that you had a ground glass that would fit the camera. Yes, by all means use the ground glass, but it must be in the exact plane the film goes. If you don't have a ground glass back assembly and you simply put a ground glass against the back of the camera it will be too far foward. If it is small enough to fit against the film guides in your roll film back it is perfect.

Neal

45PSS · Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2002 4:12 am Post subject:

If you don't have a machinist ruller or simular percision measuring device, get one. Install the ground glass and focus the lens, infinity or whatever, and lock rails. Remove the lens board assembly and measure from gorund glass to inside edge of standard. YES, exercise care as not to puncture bellows or scratch ground glass. Record measurement. Install rollfilm back in place of ground glass and measure from rollfilm film plane to same point on front standard inside. Measurements must be equal.
Charles

_________________
The best camera ever made is the one that YOU enjoy using and produces the image quality that satifies YOU.