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US WWII war cos in germany

 
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walker war cos



Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 5
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 1:35 pm    Post subject: US WWII war cos in germany Reply with quote

Hello every body,

my name is Joerg, I live in Germany.

Im a member of a US WWII reenacting group in Germany.

We have a new theme since a short time. It is WWII US war corespondent in europe.

There fore we use two Graflex cameras, but I dont know exactly which type we use.

Who can help?








The smaller camera body is 5.5 x 6.5

The bigger one is 6.5 x 7.5



Thank you Joe (rg)




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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The one on the left is a 3 1/4 x 4 1/4 (commonly referred to as a 3x4) made sometime in 1941 to mid '42. The military didn't use 3x4 cameras and at some point they stopped production until the war was over. But as a war correspondent, I would think almost anything goes.

The one on the right is a 4x5 Speed Graphic made between 1943-1945. The lens might be older than the camera. Dial Compur shutters didn't normally appear after the war started, having been replaced with US made Supermatic shutters.

HOWEVER. Most if not all of the better Ektar lenses and Supermatic shutters were going to the US Government for military use. Civilians and even pseudo-civilian war correspondents had to make to with what was available, and that makes this lens / shutter a very good 're-enactment' camera

I can't read what the lens is, it's usually a Carl Zeizz Jena Tessar or a Kodak Anastigmat.
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walker war cos



Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 5
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Les wrote:
The one on the left is a 3 1/4 x 4 1/4 (commonly referred to as a 3x4) made sometime in 1941 to mid '42. The military didn't use 3x4 cameras and at some point they stopped production until the war was over. But as a war correspondent, I would think almost anything goes.

The one on the right is a 4x5 Speed Graphic made between 1943-1945. The lens might be older than the camera. Dial Compur shutters didn't normally appear after the war started, having been replaced with US made Supermatic shutters.

HOWEVER. Most if not all of the better Ektar lenses and Supermatic shutters were going to the US Government for military use. Civilians and even pseudo-civilian war correspondents had to make to with what was available, and that makes this lens / shutter a very good 're-enactment' camera

I can't read what the lens is, it's usually a Carl Zeizz Jena Tessar or a Kodak Anastigmat.




Thank you for your explanation.

The lens on the bigger (black) camera is a COMPUR JCA or ICA Dresden Germany. Pat. 1914

The serial no is: 329439

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The serial no of the smaller one is: 386021


Joerg



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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 329xxx serial number places the camera sometime in 1944 (there were several batches, but none have a monthly date) The fact that this shutter is engraved ICA makes me believe it's not original to the camera as it left New York. ICA was a camera company with no relationship to Graflex, and it would be difficult to believe Graflex put a competitor's lens/shutter on it. When the switch was made would be impossible to pinpoint. The camera could have been sold by Graflex without a lens and an American put the lens on during the war. If the camera ended up in Germany / Europe it could have been added after the war. It is interesting that they added / used the solenoid, which leads be to believe the lens was added a long time ago. Most people today wouldn't bother with it.

The 386XXX camera is interesting in that it should be part of the first batch of cameras of the Pacemaker style made in '46, though it clearly is not.

It wouldn't be the first time serial numbers on cameras contradicted either the serial number book or the camera itself.

(I am assuming these were camera serial numbers, not lens serial numbers)
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pv17vv



Joined: 22 Dec 2001
Posts: 255
Location: The Ardennes, Belgium

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mein lieber Joe(rg), herzlich Wilkommen hier !

Are we speaking of LENS or CAMERA serials ???

The ICA-marked Compur is obviously older than the camera, ICA disappearing from the scene mid-twenties when major optic companies merged to create Zeiss.

Did you buy this 4x5 camera as is and where ( Europe or US ? ), or did you put bits together to create it ?

mfG

Georges
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walker war cos



Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 5
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pv17vv wrote:
Mein lieber Joe(rg), herzlich Wilkommen hier !

Are we speaking of LENS or CAMERA serials ???

The ICA-marked Compur is obviously older than the camera, ICA disappearing from the scene mid-twenties when major optic companies merged to create Zeiss.

Did you buy this 4x5 camera as is and where ( Europe or US ? ), or did you put bits together to create it ?

mfG

Georges




Hi Georges,

sehr freundlich von dir, Danke!

Where do you live in the Ardennes?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

the numbers are the camera nos.

I bought both like they are now, in USA.


Joerg



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glennfromwy



Joined: 29 Nov 2001
Posts: 903
Location: S.W. Wyoming

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Ica (Dresden) name was gone long before the war and the dial set Compur shutters were replaced by the rim set variety in '29 or '30. It's common to see all kinds of mix and match items on these cameras. The Ica lens should be a Tessar and they are very good lenses. Ica was absorbed into the Zeiss Ikon group.
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"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"
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willysmb



Joined: 28 Feb 2004
Posts: 115
Location: France _ Europe

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Walter,
Some infos about SC Speed Graphic here : http://www.willysmb.com/

Hope can help you. Cheers

Laurent
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walker war cos



Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 5
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello everybody

Thank you all, for all the information.



Joerg


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