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Graflex 22 rollfilm holder

 
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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2001 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone got an idea what goes wrong with the graflex 22 back when the spacing is wrong? It stops on the numbers as it should but only got 8 pictures and they were not 6x6. Russ
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alecj



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 853
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2001 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like you've got a 22 insert inside a 23 rollholder. Do the numbers count up to 12 [correct for a 22] or only 8 [correct for a 23]. What does the format opening of the rollholder look like? Is it square?Remember, it is the rollholder [some call the wrap around] that controls the format, not the insert.

[ This Message was edited by: alecj on 2001-09-29 06:31 ]
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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2001 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The insert goes from 1-12, and the rollholder has a square opening. Nothing seems to slip, and counts 12 times. I have other ones ,a 23 with rollers, and a 23 without rollers,and RH10 and while the spacing is not perfect they are useable. Russ
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alecj



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 853
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2001 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Russ, I guess I didn't understand your message that: "only got 8 pictures and they were not 6x6". What size were the negatives. If the rollholder opening is square, the negatives should be square too.
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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2001 4:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I think its time to run another roll thru this holder as # one son did this last one. All pics were 2.25 inches high some were 2.25 wide, some were 1.9, and some were 2.0. I am beginning to wonder if he did not fully wind the film, and wound with out tripping the shutter. He is new to Graflex, and is a Nikon shooter. Will advise. Russ
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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2001 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

an laternate and slightly faster way to find out the spacing is to use an old expired roll of film and a sharpie marker.

roll the film as normal, advance to one, remove the darkslide and trace the hole of the carrier with the marker. Then advance and watch if the marked "frame" dissapears. Trace the next, etc until you are out of film, then remove and look.

When I sell a back with a spacing guarrantee this is how I prove it works.
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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well the test you suggested showed erratic spacing from 2.25 to less than 2 inches and seemed to get worse the closer you got to the end of the roll. It is useable as long as long as you don't need the full negative.I guess what I don't understand as long as the mechanics work why the spacing keeps changing. Russ
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Kim



Joined: 10 May 2001
Posts: 44
Location: upstate NY

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this is a shot in the dark since I am not really familiar with this back....but it might be possible that tension on the feeding rol might be inconsistent or even missing. This would result in the film on the takeup side being either looser than the mechanism is expecting or inconsistently rolled...in any case... if it is wound looser...each rotation of the roll would be a larger diameter than expected and so would take up more film than designed.

good luck

Kim Hartshorn
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alecj



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 853
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Russ, this is a common problem with those backs. Something in the takeup mechanism slips so the spacing changes. The back needs to be serviced. It isn't "rocket science". It can be adjusted. Hopefully someone on here knows a repairperson doing that work these days.
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Henry



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 1427
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to the Graflex "shop manual" on roll holders (Jan. '65, reprint available from http://www.photobooksonline.com), and I quote, "Trouble: Not full number of pictures per roll or pictures in wrong position on roll. Cause: Lock lever assembly (24, fig. 1) bent or damaged. Remedy: replace lock lever." If this is indeed the cause of jdman's problem, the fix may indeed be closer to rocket science, as it would appear from the exploded view that reaching part #24 (the lock lever) requires an extensive tear-down of the top plate and associated mechanisms thereunder, for starters. Then all you have to do is find a replacement lock lever. (Better: find lever, then do tear-down.) Oh, the joys....
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alecj



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 853
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Not rocket science" for a repairman. For one looking at problems with electronic shutters routinely, though, I would guess it not to be that hard. The part is most likely just bent somewhat. He should be able to hear the loose part if it broke off.

I was just trying to give the guy HOPE!!!!! These days we should think POSITIVE, right?
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Henry



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 1427
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2001 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure, why not? But while we're in diagnostic/speculation mode, here's another possibility: the teeth on the cam engaged by the lock lever may be worn, accounting for the uneven spacing. This is part no. 30 in fig. 1 of the manual I cited (page 4). Now you're looking at finding a replacement cam. Optimistically, a bent lever would seem the easiest fix, yet I wonder how much tear-down is needed just to reach, let alone remove, it (if necessary).

But before panic sets in, may I suggest as a first step that lubrication may be in order? As I've posted before on these pages, a mix of lighter fluid and powdered graphite squirted into the works through the various orifices around the moving parts on the top of the holder may free up any balky action and improve the situation dramatically.
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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2001 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I tore it apart (disassembled) no surprises, nothing broken, no teeth missing,nothing bent, feed reel had same tension as my other backs, (5), the negatives such as they are appear to be sharp, which to be indicates tension is o.k.Will let you know if anything good comes out of this. Thanks for you comments, Russ
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